Comments on: Zend PHP Framework not a rumor http://www.procata.com/blog/archives/2005/10/18/zend-php-framework-not-a-rumor/ PHP Programming, Web Development, PHP Advocacy and PHP Best Practices. Sat, 11 Feb 2012 14:53:56 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.6 hourly 1 By: Rayford Feierman http://www.procata.com/blog/archives/2005/10/18/zend-php-framework-not-a-rumor/#comment-85061 Rayford Feierman Wed, 02 Jun 2010 11:39:19 +0000 http://www.procata.com/blog/?p=147#comment-85061 Really enjoyed this, thanks for posting. What is the affiliation with <a href="http://www.l3media.com" rel="nofollow">web design san diego</a> meetup group next month? Really enjoyed this, thanks for posting. What is the affiliation with web design san diego meetup group next month?

]]> By: Ahmed Saad http://www.procata.com/blog/archives/2005/10/18/zend-php-framework-not-a-rumor/#comment-12216 Ahmed Saad Sun, 30 Oct 2005 23:40:48 +0000 http://www.procata.com/blog/?p=147#comment-12216 I wonder whether Zend will release the framework and/or a basic version of the IDE as open source projects. I wonder whether Zend will release the framework and/or a basic version of the IDE as open source projects.

]]> By: Justin Rebelo http://www.procata.com/blog/archives/2005/10/18/zend-php-framework-not-a-rumor/#comment-12164 Justin Rebelo Thu, 27 Oct 2005 15:12:28 +0000 http://www.procata.com/blog/?p=147#comment-12164 I think the problem is less that the existing PHP frameworks are overly and heavyweight and more that they terribly documented. While I am a full-time PHP developer, I have started playing with Ruby on Rails in my spare time to sate my desire for a solid, well-designed framework. After I got into it, I started looking at the many php solutions (cake, mojavi, and others). In the end I downloaded around half a dozen PHP web application frameworks and not a single one of them had anything that could be regarded as even mildly adequate documentation. In fact, the majority of them lacked so much as an install document to get the platform up and running. The best I could find, in many cases, was a tutorial on USING the framework which assumes you spend the time learning how to configure it to a working state. I work in a PHP development house and I am pretty excited to see the Zend framework. I think the problem is less that the existing PHP frameworks are overly and heavyweight and more that they terribly documented. While I am a full-time PHP developer, I have started playing with Ruby on Rails in my spare time to sate my desire for a solid, well-designed framework. After I got into it, I started looking at the many php solutions (cake, mojavi, and others). In the end I downloaded around half a dozen PHP web application frameworks and not a single one of them had anything that could be regarded as even mildly adequate documentation.

In fact, the majority of them lacked so much as an install document to get the platform up and running. The best I could find, in many cases, was a tutorial on USING the framework which assumes you spend the time learning how to configure it to a working state.

I work in a PHP development house and I am pretty excited to see the Zend framework.

]]> By: Andi Gutmans http://www.procata.com/blog/archives/2005/10/18/zend-php-framework-not-a-rumor/#comment-11622 Andi Gutmans Wed, 19 Oct 2005 05:15:00 +0000 http://www.procata.com/blog/?p=147#comment-11622 Hi Jeff, As you pointed out, the need is definitely there. I also agree that it is difficult to keep a framework simple. The guidelines of this project is "Extreme simplicity", or in other words, we will try and do the 20% that addresses 80% of the need. I believe that if we try and address 100%, we will very quickly end up with Java-like frameworks that are overly complex and hard to use (and I suffered from J2EE myself). It's a lot a matter of mindset and self-control, and by making sure all our developers have "Extreme Simplicity" on their whiteboards, I also think we can achieve that. For features outside these guidelines, we will try provide extensibility, and very much make it a use-at-will architecture, so you can plug in something more powerful if you need it. For example, our database interface will be relatively simple (but quite powerful and nice), and will allow people to control their own queries if they need to. In any case, I hope we will be able to put up some short code examples of some completed work in the next couple of weeks; but it will take a while longer to be fully baked. Andi Hi Jeff,

As you pointed out, the need is definitely there.
I also agree that it is difficult to keep a framework simple. The guidelines of this project is “Extreme simplicity”, or in other words, we will try and do the 20% that addresses 80% of the need. I believe that if we try and address 100%, we will very quickly end up with Java-like frameworks that are overly complex and hard to use (and I suffered from J2EE myself).
It’s a lot a matter of mindset and self-control, and by making sure all our developers have “Extreme Simplicity” on their whiteboards, I also think we can achieve that.
For features outside these guidelines, we will try provide extensibility, and very much make it a use-at-will architecture, so you can plug in something more powerful if you need it. For example, our database interface will be relatively simple (but quite powerful and nice), and will allow people to control their own queries if they need to.
In any case, I hope we will be able to put up some short code examples of some completed work in the next couple of weeks; but it will take a while longer to be fully baked.

Andi

]]>